Curiosity.

[Uncle Adam.]

I've posted this here, because I think it's relevant to Puberty especially for boys and doesn't belong in debates.

A lot of guys post here about experimentation and curiosity which seems to become an important issue/topic of conversation. My whole thing is it's fine to want to do that, but then doesn't just make you bisexual? There is a theory that everyone is bisexual and some people lean to the one side of the spectrum or to the other side - gay and straight, but then there is this grey area which it seems is huge.

So with that said, isn't it fair to say that if a guy or girl, but we shall say guys for now, are doing homosexual acts, they are really bisexual not straight but curious? Do you think that this is specifically related to puberty or do you think it comes way before, but hasn't been acted upon until puberty. Plus experimentation has a very fine line, so where does one draw it? Borderline gay?

There was a long discussion about hormones in here, which I am also keen to pick up on if I can find the thread.

http://forums.govteen.com/showthread.php?t=239571 Here is that thread.

Discuss. I'm interested to know.

[msnicondude]

How do you define gay? I would of thought that it was 'love' for a person of the male gender, an emotional attraction. So thus, experimenting doesn't come under the gay - grey area.. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just putting something out there!

[phantasmagoria]

Originally Posted by msnicondude

How do you define gay? I would of thought that it was 'love' for a person of the male gender, an emotional attraction. So thus, experimenting doesn't come under the gay - grey area.. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just putting something out there!

Gay can be defined many ways.
The most common and accepted one is for a male to feel physically, mentally, and emotionally attracted to another male..as they would to a woman.

But I would think someone would need to be with both sexes consistently to be considered Bi-sexual. Other than that I believe it's Bi-curious/Straight-curious whatever you want to call it.

[MonsteRawrhh]

i think a gay person is someone who emotion, and physical wants the same sex. and as for bi-curious i dont belive that some can be that. i think there is just straight, bisexuals, homosexuals.
and personally i think if anyone goes over wanking with a mate (not wanking there friends penis) then they might be gay or bi.

i am bisexual and its true people do sway alittle more to one side, i sway to girls more but thats because i find that i have a emotional and physical attraction to girls, whereas to guys i only have a physical attraction.

[Cosmic]

I think in the midst of it all, you'd be hard pushed to search for a definition.

If the feelings for one's own sex (or indeed the other) are no longer present after hormones have settled down and you are a fully grown adult, then can you really be considered bisexual when you no longer hold any form of attraction at all to one of the genders?

Arguably your sexuality is more than your sexual attraction, many claim that your sexuality is a combination of your emotional and sexual attractions and connections. There has to be more than a purely sexual motive, otherwise it's arguably just hormones. I remain undecided on this idea. There's the possibility this argument holds a lot of support from those in denial about their sexuality, so arguably the motives behind such a theory can leave it questionable. I think it's possible, for example, to have just a sexual attraction to some people, and an emotional and sexual attraction to others. The presence of sexual only attraction does not discount the chance of an emotional attraction later on, be it to the same, or a different person.

In my opinion - sexuality labels are fairly pointless. We are far too complex to fall 100% into such limiting labels and categories, so people should start worrying less about their label, and more about being true to what they enjoy and look for.

[msnicondude]

Originally Posted by Spin

I think in the midst of it all, you'd be hard pushed to search for a definition.

If the feelings for one's own sex (or indeed the other) are no longer present after hormones have settled down and you are a fully grown adult, then can you really be considered bisexual when you no longer hold any form of attraction at all to one of the genders?

Arguably your sexuality is more than your sexual attraction, many claim that your sexuality is a combination of your emotional and sexual attractions and connections. There has to be more than a purely sexual motive, otherwise it's arguably just hormones. I remain undecided on this idea. There's the possibility this argument holds a lot of support from those in denial about their sexuality, so arguably the motives behind such a theory can leave it questionable. I think it's possible, for example, to have just a sexual attraction to some people, and an emotional and sexual attraction to others. The presence of sexual only attraction does not discount the chance of an emotional attraction later on, be it to the same, or a different person.

In my opinion - sexuality labels are fairly pointless. We are far too complex to fall 100% into such limiting labels and categories, so people should start worrying less about their label, and more about being true to what they enjoy and look for.

You moderators always surprise me with the intelligence, thought and maturity with your answers. This pretty much sums it up for me. Kudos (Y)

[And?]

I had a long ass conversation with Luke about this a while ago; him defending the influence of hormones, and myself calling it a coward's explanation for homosexuality.

I think the first myth you've got to look at is the fact that hormones don't directly cause curiosity. They just don't. That doesn't work physiologically. There needs to be a predisposition to homosexual acts (handjobs, blowjobs, anal sex, etc.) for these hormones to have any effect whatsoever. They make you aroused: they don't make you like dick. It just doesn't work like that. Obviously, the indirect influence of the hormones on your arousal levels could mean that you're more likely to take sex where you can find it, so in that sense you could "blame" hormones.

The next thing you've got to look at it is who is experimenting, who is lying, and who is repeating? The people who experiment: are they curious about their sexualities, or just randy little fuckers? How many people who come on here lie about this? Or are asking how to do it, but then never go through with it? It's a fiction they fantasise but never implement; just the same as how I'm still wearing a dressing gown at 2 in the afternoon. The fallacy comes when you say "Oh, those boys? They're just curious". I'm talking the ones who keep going back for dick. I'm sorry, that's gay. It just is. You cannot pawn it off as curiosity because it stretches the word so far, something's going to rupture . Curiosity is to want to find out about something: when you know about it, you are satiated. Sorry, being repeatedly pummelled isn't curiosity, the act doesn't change, you already know what it is.

However, having spoken to Luke those weeks ago, he highlighted the importance of hormones as a get-out-of-confusion-card. It's a nice thing for people to be able to blame, and it prevents them from having to question who they are at such an early age. Is this a good thing? Or does it harm them in the long run? Would we end up with more faux-gays if they realised experimenting was really, really gay? Would we end up with more people at peace with their sexuality if they were forced to confront who they were at an early age?

I don't think you can find out here: it's way too liberal on this site. Knowledge is power, but it needs to be clear and proven. I'd be afraid of telling people that it's not hormones, until that's been shown accurate; I'm also equally afraid of saying to people "Oh yeah just hormones", when I believe in my heart and brain that that is not true.

I disagree, but agree with Declan about labelling. I, too, think it's unnecessary to get hung up on, but people do, and it has important connotations of self. So, in that sense, it's important to label yourself, so that you can easily identify who you are - it's a shame, people should just be happy as fluid, amorphous blobs.

There are loads of other, more reasoned, explanations for curiosity, I think, rather than just hormones. Whether they act alone, or together, I'm not sure about. Things like environment, socialisation, self-validation, pubertal "need" (fuck that) to compare, societal expectations of peers, development of sexuality, peer pressure, general extreme levels of arousal, earlier onset of puberty. I mean, it goes on forever.

For true bisexuality, there does need to be a physical and emotional attraction, and that's often overlooked. I'm not going to expand on this, because Declan has covered it well and there's no point in me just rephrasing what he has said.

I think this is a good quote, though I can't remember where I read it, so free free to question its validity:

"It not only has a part in generating feelings of sexual desire, claim scientists, but is also at the root of other types of arousal - producing alertness or even fear. (oestregen)"

To sum up my unbelievably convoluted argument (piss off, it's early and I'm tired): I believe you cannot just put down experimentation to hormones, for biological and logical reasons. I think there needs to be an innate predisposition to exploration of sexuality, and thus a tendency to homosexuality or bisexuality, in order for repeated experimentation to take place. I think it's important to give people the most accurate information possible, but that saying this in every thread would be inordinately over complex and would be counter-productive. I think more research needs to be done in order to educate people. I don't think that one experiment makes you gay, or even bisexual, but I think going back for it again makes you 'not straight'. I think it's feeble, and wrong, to claim it's "something everybody does" and that "it's natural". It's not either of those things; neither is it wrong.

Yeah.

[rockonyar]

I agree with spin on the most part. I beleive there is a huge grey area And people lean on one side or the other. Truthfully I don't believe that anyone is 100% straight nor 100% gay. I think everyone is a mix of gay and straight but some have more gay characteristics and some have more straight characteristics

[And?]

I'm going to temp sticky this, actually, 'cause it's interesting. Let's get some more ideas, guys. Imsrsly.

[msnicondude]

But it seems a lot of people do it at a young age, but I personally think that the hundreds that do it will eventually grow out of it (once puberty finishes) and get real, serious girlfriends. It just seems like a 'teen' thing to do.

[Redemption]

Just cause you experimented (over 3 and that's just something else), I don't think you're bisexual. And even if you think you're gay, straight or bi, I really think you should just wait till you're 25, and you'll be sure. I know so many people who kept changing as they went from 13-25-ish.
And don't forget the asexuals...

[And?]

Originally Posted by msnicondude

But it seems a lot of people do it at a young age, but I personally think that the hundreds that do it will eventually grow out of it (once puberty finishes) and get real, serious girlfriends. It just seems like a 'teen' thing to do.

I agree, but I personally want to know why. Why do people grow out of it? Biological reason? Maturity? Hormones in puberty aren't that extreme; we just like to overplay them because it's a easy sell.

Originally Posted by Redemption

Just cause you experimented (over 3 and that's just something else), I don't think you're bisexual. And even if you think you're gay, straight or bi, I really think you should just wait till you're 25, and you'll be sure. I know so many people who kept changing as they went from 13-25-ish.
And don't forget the asexuals...

Yes, over 3 is most definitely something else. Why 25? I think that's a bit late, really. I'm desperately trying to find a thread that debated the growth of the frontal cortex by 25. But I'll be fucked if I can find it.

[Zeus.]

I have definitely killed the cat.

[Prime]

Originally Posted by Lawl

I agree, but I personally want to know why. Why do people grow out of it? Biological reason? Maturity? Hormones in puberty aren't that extreme; we just like to overplay them because it's a easy sell.

perhaps you are right and hormones in puberty arent that extreme but what about the amount of hormones?

it could also be simply because the surge in hormones that were not very active previously causes a huge insane desire/urge to do something. because we do not have "experience"with these desires, maybe the human body is not equipped enough to resist them.

as we grow up, become more mature, are we actually becoming mature?
or is it the novelty of life that wears of?
i dont believe that people actually mature, i mean there are older folk out there who are worse than some children. i think its to novelty, the experiences that you have that "determines" ones maturity.

like remember the time when boys could only become men by war? have you thought why? it is likely that our ancestors recognized that ability(or inability) for mental growth(aka maturity) when one is faced new and different experiences.

this said, it may be that the initial novelty of sex has worn off?

by making this statement i am sure that someone will come back and say "novelty of sex never wears of" or "sex is so exciting" or some other random shit along that line.


well think about it, novelty is the experience of something new. whereas sex is a desire caused by hormones because we have animal instincts( the instinct to carry on life).




wat did i just type??

[Casey]

K. So I do believe *almost* everyone is bisexual. Because many people are sexually attracted to both genders, which is why I hesitate to say anyone is "experimenting," nor do I like saying that anyone is gay or straight. I think everyone's sexuality is different, no one is exactly the same in their psychosexual make-up. Gay, straight, or bi are all incredibly constricting terms on someones sexuality. There are guys that I would have sex with. Plain and simple, but there's no guy that I can honestly see myself ever being romantically involved with, or marrying etc, but I vastly prefer women.

So you know what my sexual orientation is? Casey. That's how I do.

My honest opinion is that gay, straight, curious is all bullshit, especially curious, because curious, as an orientation, is bi. The concept, after some thinking, is pure stupid.
Guy) "I sexually like both men and women."
Someone else) "Oh well you're not bisexual, even though you pretty much just spit up the definition."
Guy) "Well thanks, I'll be sure to have meaningless 'experimental' sex and stay sexually repressed for awhile."

Don't get me wrong, I have been pretty lax in the past with tossing around the 'experimenting' and 'curious' definitions for people, but I've begun to shy away from it lately for the exact reasons stated above.