Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 19
  1. #1
    Batman is offline
    (Jake)
    Member Batman's Avatar
    Join Date
    October 27th, 2002
    Location
    32°N 89°W
    Age
    28
    Gender
    Posts
    11,734

    Default Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?


    *Ads Disappear After 100 Posts*
    What do you think about a filibuster, that is somebody taking the floor of a legislative branch of government and holding the floor until it is time for the branch to adjourn, there by preventing things from being presented and being voted on.

    Currently filibusters are legal in the United States but there is a process known as a cloture in place which allows a filibuster to forced to end provided that 60 senators are in favor of ending the filibuster.

    So where you stand on if filibusters should be allowed or not? Some say that they are just dirty tricks that allows the non-majority the ability to prevent things from being passed that would other wise be passed and it waste the potential benefits a session could accomplish.

    While other say that filibusters are a legitimate way for the non-majority to keep the majority in check.

    What say you?

    ____________________


    The best spiritual friend is one that attacks your hidden faults - Atiśa Dipankara Shrijnana
    ____________________




    • Advertising


  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    April 15th, 2002
    Location
    Ottawa
    Age
    26
    Gender
    Posts
    18,916

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Its rather silly, but so is the entire American electoral system, so I might argue that it fits in there rather well...


  3. #3
    iwpoe is offline
    (Matt)
    Moderator iwpoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 16th, 2002
    Location
    America
    Gender
    Posts
    19,113

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    It's part of the system not a "dirty trick" (at least, not to the extent that we refuse to call "dirty tricks" part of the system). There are any number of analog acts in parliamentary systems- walkouts for example. The ultimate end of politics is the expression of political will not the playing out of some arbitrary set of rules. The filibuster is a formal political mechanism to allow for the dissenting minority to have a say. If that mechanism were not present the minority would see its will done in other, less formal, ways.
    Confused by the ToS rules? Read my summary.
    Yes, I am fully aware that I am difficult to read.

    lol Hemlock

    Mispelling everything since 1999

    Buy me a book for my library

    ---

    Faun’s flesh is not to us,
    Nor the saint’s vision.
    We have the press for wafer;
    Franchise for circumcision.

    All men, in law, are equals.
    Free of Peἰsistratus,
    We choose a knave or an eunuch
    To rule over us.

    O bright Apollo,
    τίν' άνδρα, τίν' ἥρωα, τίνα θεὸν,
    What god, man, or hero
    Shall I place a tin wreath upon!
    ~Ezra Pound, "Hugh Selwyn Mauberly"

    ---

    Oh Mensch! Gieb Acht!
    Was spricht die tiefe Mitternacht?
    „Ich schlief, ich schlief —,
    „Aus tiefem Traum bin ich erwacht: —
    „Die Welt ist tief,
    „Und tiefer als der Tag gedacht.
    „Tief ist ihr Weh —,
    „Lust — tiefer noch als Herzeleid:
    „Weh spricht: Vergeh!
    „Doch alle Lust will Ewigkeit —,
    „—will tiefe, tiefe Ewigkeit!
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spoke Zarathustra, Chapter 59, "The Second Dance-Song"

  4. #4
    Oxford is offline
    (Phillip)
    Member Oxford's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 6th, 2003
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Gender
    Posts
    8,448

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    The House of Representatives has done away with the filibuster, I don't see why the Senate should keep it. If everyone were to filibuster, nothing would get done.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    August 29th, 2004
    Posts
    18,208

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxford View Post
    The House of Representatives has done away with the filibuster, I don't see why the Senate should keep it. If everyone were to filibuster, nothing would get done.
    Well...yes.

    However, I doubt either party would be willing to pay the price associated with shutting down government in that way.
    "...there is no justice. The rich win - the poor are powerless." - The Verdict
    Amnesty International's current report on China http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/china/report-2011
    Skeptic's Annotated Bible http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/
    Religious Tolerance Site http://www.religioustolerance.org/

  6. #6
    'Oseé is offline
    (Josh)
    Member
    Join Date
    January 21st, 2007
    Age
    22
    Gender
    Posts
    10,360

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxford View Post
    If everyone were to filibuster, nothing would get done.
    That's part of the reason why the House doesn't filibuster. 435 people all filibustering would be silly...

    Though, does the filibuster really wreak havoc on agenda to the extent that nothing is getting done? Is the situation that bad? The longest filibuster ever was just over 24-hours long so really, the most time that could be lost would only equal one or two Senate meetings.


  7. #7
    iwpoe is offline
    (Matt)
    Moderator iwpoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 16th, 2002
    Location
    America
    Gender
    Posts
    19,113

    Lightbulb Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxford View Post
    If everyone were to filibuster, nothing would get done.
    The suspension of activities in resistance to certain political actions is a viable political act. Successfully preventing the nomination of certain judges is "getting something done."
    Confused by the ToS rules? Read my summary.
    Yes, I am fully aware that I am difficult to read.

    lol Hemlock

    Mispelling everything since 1999

    Buy me a book for my library

    ---

    Faun’s flesh is not to us,
    Nor the saint’s vision.
    We have the press for wafer;
    Franchise for circumcision.

    All men, in law, are equals.
    Free of Peἰsistratus,
    We choose a knave or an eunuch
    To rule over us.

    O bright Apollo,
    τίν' άνδρα, τίν' ἥρωα, τίνα θεὸν,
    What god, man, or hero
    Shall I place a tin wreath upon!
    ~Ezra Pound, "Hugh Selwyn Mauberly"

    ---

    Oh Mensch! Gieb Acht!
    Was spricht die tiefe Mitternacht?
    „Ich schlief, ich schlief —,
    „Aus tiefem Traum bin ich erwacht: —
    „Die Welt ist tief,
    „Und tiefer als der Tag gedacht.
    „Tief ist ihr Weh —,
    „Lust — tiefer noch als Herzeleid:
    „Weh spricht: Vergeh!
    „Doch alle Lust will Ewigkeit —,
    „—will tiefe, tiefe Ewigkeit!
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche, Thus Spoke Zarathustra, Chapter 59, "The Second Dance-Song"

  8. #8
    Crash Override is offline
    (Justin)
    Member Crash Override's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 2nd, 2007
    Location
    Maryland, USA
    Age
    21
    Gender
    Posts
    16,651
    My Diary
    ( 1 )

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    I think its just part of the politics. Those lying poltical scumbags want it their way, and will use whatever thay can to get it.
    Mess with the best, die like the rest.
    Communities Moderator
    Blogs and Groups Moderator
    Leonardo DiCaprio deserves an Oscar!




  9. #9
    Buddy is offline
    (Ben)
    Boss Member Buddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    July 2nd, 2002
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Age
    24
    Gender
    Posts
    7,497

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    I don't know why America preaches democracy to other countries when they can't get it to work right in their own country.
    No regrets.
    I'm blessed to say the old me dead and gone away.

  10. #10
    Oxford is offline
    (Phillip)
    Member Oxford's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 6th, 2003
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Gender
    Posts
    8,448

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Quote Originally Posted by Josh View Post
    That's part of the reason why the House doesn't filibuster. 435 people all filibustering would be silly...

    Though, does the filibuster really wreak havoc on agenda to the extent that nothing is getting done? Is the situation that bad? The longest filibuster ever was just over 24-hours long so really, the most time that could be lost would only equal one or two Senate meetings.
    Thankfully most people recognize that it's an extreme action and it doesn't happen all that often. There's a time for pluralism and there's a time for yielding to the majority.

    Quote Originally Posted by Buddy View Post
    I don't know why America preaches democracy to other countries when they can't get it to work right in their own country.
    That's a sharp accusation, you can't just post a sentence like that with nothing to back it up. How does our democracy "not work right"?

  11. #11
    Krzysio is offline
    (Christopher)
    Member
    Join Date
    September 29th, 2002
    Age
    26
    Gender
    Posts
    11,658

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxford View Post
    That's a sharp accusation, you can't just post a sentence like that with nothing to back it up. How does our democracy "not work right"?
    I think a lot of countries have their positives and negatives.

    I don't know that much about the U.S. system, but it seems to me that the Canadian system is much more pluralistic in the sense that the head of government is much more directly elected by the people. Also, minor parties have a much bigger role in terms of policy creation as their votes are still necessary to minority governments.

    At the same time U.S. has it more sensible by allowing some votes to pass while others fail. Canada has this weird custom where elections have to be called if a vote fails; pretty much any vote. What if on some cases Canada (through its representatives) supports the ruling party and in other cases not? Unless this leads to drastic and ridiculous contradictions it should be like the U.S., I think

  12. #12
    Dawn is offline
    (Dawn)
    Member Dawn's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 9th, 2006
    Location
    SW-Florida
    Gender
    Posts
    3,315

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    I don't think it's right that a minority can usurp the will of the majority.
    This is not democracy.

  13. #13
    brightside. is offline
    (Zain)
    Member brightside.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    August 8th, 2004
    Location
    Anfield
    Gender
    Posts
    16,964

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    After having learnt the meaning of a filibuster through the excellent film "Mr. Smith Goes to Washington", I cannot help but be in favor of it.

    If anyone can manage that, they deserve to stall their opponents haha
    .

    Lover of cold brewskies

  14. #14
    The Best Member CiceroXVII's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 21st, 2002
    Location
    Mary Land
    Gender
    Posts
    36,563

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZenaGirl View Post
    I don't think it's right that a minority can usurp the will of the majority.
    This is not democracy.
    No, it's not, and it's a good thing to know that a bill will never pass Congress without a majority of votes.
    SOMECOMMUNITIES: A Forum Community


    "I believe that in 1978 God changed his mind about black people!
    You can be a Mormon, a Mormon who just
    believes!" -- Kevin Price

    "Joseph Smith, don't fuck the baby. I'll get rid of your AIDS if you fuck this frog." -- God

    ______
    ADIOGL

  15. #15
    Dawn is offline
    (Dawn)
    Member Dawn's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 9th, 2006
    Location
    SW-Florida
    Gender
    Posts
    3,315

    Default Re: Filibuster - Dirty trick or legitment power check?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cicero17 View Post
    No, it's not, and it's a good thing to know that a bill will never pass Congress without a majority of votes.
    A bill can't pass Congress without a majority of votes anyway.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. The knuckle trick
    By Punjabi Kudi in forum The Countdown Forum
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: Nov-18-2007, 06:13 PM
  2. Trick situation, help
    By jgpjetta in forum Love and Dating
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: Nov-09-2006, 01:27 AM
  3. Trick or Treat
    By Stangy in forum The Countdown Forum
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: Nov-01-2006, 12:24 AM
  4. Presidential Signing Statements: legitamate power or power grab?
    By Watcher in forum Debates & Discussions
    Replies: 34
    Last Post: Jan-29-2006, 07:51 PM
  5. Trick or Eat
    By Punjabi Kudi in forum The Anthropology & Geography Diary
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: Nov-05-2005, 09:07 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •